Converting replica Weber 48 IDA's to EFI

[Waitey]

All in and working.

[GDCobra]

Well they work!

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/nS4D7tTh4XU

Sounds good!

[Waitey]

Well they work!

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/nS4D7tTh4XU

[GDCobra]

There are ITBs out there that already do as you say but I think the idea was to retain the heritage look without the considerable cost of the off the shelf EFI options.
But yes height is sacrificed in this instance.

I have done something similar but with the jenvey separate ITB's.  This is the mock up manifold, the real is being CNC'd and runners done in 3D printed aluminium.  One advantage of the individuals over IDA's is that the injectors point directly at the intake valve rather than being offset.  The heritage style do look awesome though.

Well I wasn't necessarily thinking of making the bodies individual, more along the lines of keeping them paired up and cutting them similar to the carb' bodies just making a little shorter and/or incorporating the injector into the main body.  That would keep the looks similar but also (possibly) keep the linkages simpler.

That's another nice project you've got going too.  I need to stop looking at these or I'll start getting ideas myself!

[GTR_Garner]

That's a nice looking project, I wish you all the best with it.

Underbonnet clearance looks a bit tight which makes me wonder if it would be easier/better/cheaper to machine the throttle bodies from solid and combine the injector and butterfly in a shorter assembly to get it a little more compact.

There are ITBs out there that already do as you say but I think the idea was to retain the heritage look without the considerable cost of the off the shelf EFI options.
But yes height is sacrificed in this instance.

I have done something similar but with the jenvey separate ITB's.  This is the mock up manifold, the real is being CNC'd and runners done in 3D printed aluminium.  One advantage of the individuals over IDA's is that the injectors point directly at the intake valve rather than being offset.  The heritage style do look awesome though.

[GDCobra]

That's a nice looking project, I wish you all the best with it.

Underbonnet clearance looks a bit tight which makes me wonder if it would be easier/better/cheaper to machine the throttle bodies from solid and combine the injector and butterfly in a shorter assembly to get it a little more compact.

[Waitey]

Do you have knock sensors? Or just reading the plugs?

My timing table is very much on the safe side. When you have over 500bhp, chasing that last 30 or so really isn't worth it for a road only car.

[Happy Jim]

Do you have knock sensors? Or just reading the plugs?

[Waitey]

Looks brilliant - great use of 3D printing all over, too!

I've also never done Alpha N tuning, and my understanding was that it's very compromised in a road car, so I'm really interested to hear how driveability etc are for you - perhaps my 'book' learning doesn't hold up in the real world. On paper it might have saved me some of the driveability issues I had with my old turbocharged MR2; simply breathing near the intake system (metaphorically, not literally  ) upset the MAF based map so much that I couldn't get the car up a hill..

I've owned 3 cars on ITB's using alpha n. I've just never mapped one myself!

TBH there isn't much difference in drivability, its just more time consuming/harder to map.

Correct map scaling is important too. A lot happened between 0% and 10% tps, so idle and cruise ends up living down in that part of the map. The rest is just a game of find where the car is happy.

I currently have the map set rich everywhere, ~12:1 then I'm letting the self learn function slowly pull that back to my target table.

[aaronjb]

Looks brilliant - great use of 3D printing all over, too!

I've also never done Alpha N tuning, and my understanding was that it's very compromised in a road car, so I'm really interested to hear how driveability etc are for you - perhaps my 'book' learning doesn't hold up in the real world. On paper it might have saved me some of the driveability issues I had with my old turbocharged MR2; simply breathing near the intake system (metaphorically, not literally  ) upset the MAF based map so much that I couldn't get the car up a hill..

[Waitey]

Big update time!

I've been told to get this finished soon by Mrs W.

As the office, "is a f**king state".



Completed the map line take off and the brake vac take off.



Also finished the TPS mount





More thinking.



Hole in the middle at the bottom is for the idle control air.

Tried loads of different ideas to plumb it to an idle valve. All of them required too much hose and fittings.

MG rover to the rescue. K series idle valve bolts straight up with a little 3d printed spacer.



Fuel system this weekend:

Made a little holder for the fuel filter so it can live at the back rather than the engine bay.



Fuel reg, sensor and fittings plumbed in.



ITB's fitted and the engine side of the loom is done. Also done some random plumbing etc etc.

I hate wiring!!!!!!!





Also got the throttle linkage done. I had to go out and buy a new slightly thinner cable though to work with the bell crank.

When first set up I couldn't get full throttle, I've lengthened the pedal throw now, so should be grand, and a bit like a TVR to drive, as they have really long throttle pedals.



Rails in, injectors wired up, we have pressure too!





Ecu is in the car too.



Also made a little bracket for the manifold air temp. Need to make it a little more rigid.



The ECU is alive!



Now set the crank and cam sensors in the fancy distributor




Well these HT's are as tight as they could be!




Since there's sensor inputs may as well used them.

Fuel pressure



Oil Pressure



Nothing is fun on a Sunday like taking an angle grinder to your bonnet.



Todays job - Mapping.

Never done an Alpha N tune before.



Far left screen - Terminators self generated VE map.

Centre screen - Old map from the Holley Sniper

Far right screen - New map using Alpha N

What's impressive was how close the Terminatirs self generated maps was to my old one.

Now the fun of working out where all my fuel flows should go on an Alpha N map.

Things like idle and cruise will all be in the bottom rows, then it's a case of filling in the WOT fuel and joining the dots.



The last photo is the old Sniper map flipped back to VE so you can see where idle and cruise was affecting the map.

So the little idle block needs transposing to the 1-2% TPS line on the Alpha N map and the lean cruise area needs to side in the 3-9% throttle area of the new map.


Since this all hurt my brain after a while, I had a break and did an alignment with my DIY string kit



All in spec, which is impressive since I eyeballed the re fitting of the rear end.



Oh you are beautiful. So happy with it.










Its all up and running now, tuning though came to an abrupt end, when I'd forgotten to put any fuel in it....

[GTR_Garner]

The Sniper was perfect, I wouldn't entertain a carb over one. I just always need a project.

https://www.northamptonmotorsport.com/product/ford-302-windsor-jenvey-throttle-body-kit/#throttle-position-loom-socket

£4611 + vat for a set of Jenveys.

Then you'd need a £1400 ECU

And £250 of fuel system.

So nearly £7500 all in.

Plus loom/loom modifications if your engine wasn't efi already, then mapping.

[Waitey]

Was the sniper a problem? Seen mixed reviews on YouTube. How much would the 8 stack Efi cost to buy?

The Sniper was perfect, I wouldn't entertain a carb over one. I just always need a project.

https://www.northamptonmotorsport.com/product/ford-302-windsor-jenvey-throttle-body-kit/#throttle-position-loom-socket

£4611 + vat for a set of Jenveys.

Then you'd need a £1400 ECU

And £250 of fuel system.

So nearly £7500 all in.

[KevinW]

Around £4k with the ECU and all the sensors.

Selling the Sniper and all the old intake bits netted me around £1k back.

So £3k all into it at the moment.

Was the sniper a problem? Seen mixed reviews on YouTube. How much would the 8 stack Efi cost to buy?

[GTR_Garner]

Looks good!
Solid work there!

I'm scanning a manifold tomorrow to have one designed to fit ITBs onto my 9.2" deck, will be an interesting projects but will be using similar techniques to you with carbon nylon runners etc.